Melee notes

Remember once upon a time every COR /WAR in pink bird merit pt, gain TP with a MK or Joytoy, spamming 2k slug shot every few sec, and out parse a bunch of real DDs?

As the game progress and entered VW era, majority of COR no longer do that, instead most ppl just spam WF with a staff. Although it’s also a decent way to do dmg, I realized it happened to reached the limit, no matter how hard I try, I’m unable to break the biggest curse: Shooting is just way too slow for dmg dealing.

Recent announcement of Embrava nerf made me go back and look at melee COR once again, to push COR’s performance higher in variety of events(which is my main goal since I started this job from day 1), and how viable to COR/WAR melee + last stand spam, and COR/WAR v.s COR/DNC exen spam.

Let’s start with COR/DNC exen. It actually worked well on something like Cities T4 ironclad. But as soon as I switch to Qilin, exen starting to seemed weak. After 6 pops, even with RCB and double 11 on Chaos/Fighters, I was unable to break 2k avg, in fact, only broke 2k once entire run with over 1.1k attack. It’s slightly below my BLU/WAR’s performance with CDC also, not counting TP DPS lose without ODD, and my BLU has inferior gear. According to spreadsheet and my personal experience, exen just falls behind CDC and majority of other melee WS by a large amount. Spreadsheet shows about 1.7k avg depending on setup. Not having the option to /WAR with DW also sucked, although I may actually cap or close to capped attack with No.11 chaos and if ppl stop using bio instead of Dia.

But final verdict, exen sucked. Any WS unable to avg 2k+ on lol Qilin is pretty much not an option. And Exen as a WS in this game, just isn’t a very strong one. And if I can’t reach 2k+ avg with No.11 chaos/fighter with lv 99 arma/Thaumas 4/5, no way I can avg 2.5k+ until SE release new batch of better gears. The only benefit for /DNC exen spam on qilin, is probably haste samba for none-DRK melees and that’s it. And that’s pretty debatable, /DNC just to haste 2 ppl in pt.

Side note: When I tried exen in a PUG Qilin pt though, I actually had one of highest WS avg in ally, lol VW PUG pt ;P

So that really leaves last stand, with capped pDIF as the only option. Since last stand with proper attack buff/def down is a 3k~5k WS.

1^st question I wanted to ask myself is which weapon.

There are several choices, Aluh has highest melee DPS, and minor boost for the WS. Joytoy, the melee weapon I used at 75, now no longer have good DPS but still has fast TP gain. Another option is MK, which has fastest TP gain but but complete crap melee DPS, with a risk of hitting 0 or feed too much TP.  I couldn’t tell which one is most optimal tbh, since melee COR is a play style nobody bothers anymore. There are no discussions about it, everyone and their mother just spams WF with a staff, and nobody ever bring COR to lower lv content….including myself. ;( Can’t help it, BLU with CDC is just to boss in lower lv content ;(

Personally I’m guessing with DA roll and higher DA/TA/QA etc in melee set, MK/joytoy got devalued. But the only way to find out is ask everyone’s favorite FFXI gear question machine: Spreadsheet ;)

Using DNC spreadsheet(since DNC has same dagger skill lv as COR, and similar stat lv, except a few STR higher than COR), modified sword skill to match COR’s –B rank sword skill for joy.

With /WAR, chaos, dia2, minx2+ march x2 on qilin. ( I know kinda unrealistic to have 4 songs for qilin, but last stand not worth using with high enough pDIF already, so I’ll just try to get as many as possible) Using “standard” melee set with thaumas 4/5 and Oce head, except suppa to regain moonshade earring. Spreadsheet shows using Houyi over rancor is 1 round less to 100 TP, but since there are regain atmacite in VW, I’m too lazy to truly create super optimal set with right amount of STP.

Joytoy:

Without DA roll but has chaos:

Melee dmg per round: 129

Round/WS:9.48

Melee dmg before you WS per round: 1290

Total cycle time:700

With chaos/DA roll:

Melee dmg/round:135

Total cycle time:676

Melee dmg before you WS: 1350

MK

Chaos/fighter:

Melee dmg/round:43

Round/WS:8.67

Melee dmg before you WS:387

Total cycle time:575

Chaos only:

Melee dmg/round:40

Melee dmg before you WS:360

Total cycle time:569 (yes, using DA roll with a MK actually make you TP slower ;), thus standard TP set with too much DA isn’t even optimal for MK, but that’s another issue)

Aluh:

Chaos only:

Melee dmg/round: 150

Round/WS:11.95

Melee dmg before you WS:1800

Total cycle time: 777

Chaos+DA:

Melee dmg/round:164

Round/WS:11

Melee dmg before WS:1804

Total cycle time:724

It seems that Aluh has highest melee dmg and WS dmg, but it’s TP speed is nearly 50% longer than MK(if I understand total cycle time correctly). However, it has over 1.5k melee dmg more than MK. Aluh also add about 60ish more last stand dmg with STR at capped pDIF.

In the situation when WS dmg is really high, like 3.5k~4k, or even 5k, I only see MK pulls ahead. But if last stand can’t do 3k+(not enough attack or def down), then Aluh may pull ahead. 

Note that MK also gained extra advantage with roll slot. You don’t need DA roll with MK, so 2^nd roll slot can either be hunters or regain roll depending on acc need. However, if MK can’t hit higher than 0 on the target, then MK will be completely useless.

As for joy, it seems to fall in the middle ground between both weapon, without any specific advantage. It’s melee DPS is lower than Aluh, doesn’t offer WS boost, lower skill means lower acc, in the situation when melee DPS shines Joy falls behind Aluh. It also TP slower than MK, in the situations where last stand doing crazy amount of dmg, it can’t spam LS fast enough.

Goodbye Joytoy ;( It was my precious, meant a lot back at 75, but it’s golden era is over ;( Joytoy sucked now Q.Q

Some other random fact with this setup:

Last stand is only good with capped, or very high pDIF.  So BRD attack song is pretty much must have on top of chaos. Since COR have very little attack boost ability besides chaos roll, you need every attack and def down you can possibility get.

However, you also need capped haste for TP, which means you either need embrava, 4 song BRD, or 2 x BRD rotating pt to get enough attack. Due to how hard it is to get 4 song BRD, I believe after embrava nerf COR output would drop a lot due to losing song slot for attack song, on top of losing regain on embrava since regain benefits 1h weapon more.

Sucks that COR DDing is more attack striving than any other job. No other DD job require this amount of attack/def down support to do well. MNK WAR has crit-hit WS, SAM has shoha, DRK has lots of attack, RNG has higher attack than COR also. NIN BLU all got crit-hit WS. Although DRG also suffers from low attack, it has angon to offset the disadvantage.

COR only has light shot dia def down enhancement ;(

But advantage is advantage, and it’s necessary to abuse it for most optimal output.

So if someone uses Dia, COR/WAR should always follow with a light shot period.

Sucks that ppl in VW always likes to overwrite dia with bio……………….

Need to tell ppl stop using bio in VW especially prov unless it’s confirmed to be proc ;(

Another random fact, I don’t use QD if I’m meleeing with capped haste. All that JA delay for such small dmg and TP just doesn’t seem to worth it.

Anyways, I tried spamming last stand on prov watcher instead of WF a few times, I’m pretty certain that melee for TP and spam last stand, is better than spamming WF with a staff on none firesday. Last stand can hit 3k+ on watcher easily with that much SV BRD songs, even 4k+ if your BRD’s pimp and ppl do def down properly.  And I can’t reliably hit 3k+ WF unless on firesday and lucky that no WF got resist, or got lucky with fire shot bonus.

My highest was 4.1k on dragon, although I probably can’t do that high anymore due to WS at melee range, and sacrificed more AGI for racc to land it.

Now current list of “need to work on” items for my COR:

HQ T.abj hand/body/feet.

I honestly can’t afford body atm and don’t know anyone can T1 D; Hands may be easier to get though, I know maybe 3 ppl that can T1 it.

Feet is low priority for me now, I have NQ and going to stick with it for a while.

Mythic.

Honestly can’t see a damn situation where it pulls ahead of Arma 99 unless I’m kiting something and still dealing dmg with QD blink macro, especially recently when I found out using QD with capped haste meleeing isn’t a good idea…less reason to use a high QD dmg gun now. On top of this job’s natural low TP phrase % D; SO SAD THAT MYTHIC SUCKED SO MUCH.

But still want. Not going to sell my soul to finish it though, Mythic sucked, sucked so much. And will suck unless SE gives dmg boost to dark shot, or if there’s even 1 damn situation I can get free AM3 without having to sacrifice 1 precious WS.

MK.

I didn’t spend time to play with spread sheet for nothing, I want to try it out myself instead of listing everything on paper. High priority!

Elemental Obi.

I have fire/darkness/ice and that’s it, hard to see other element being useful tbh, low priority I guess.

PDT- waist.

Too broke to afford, but I’ll try my best D;

Meeble acc back piece

If I’m going to melee in prov, I may as well take it seriously and cap my melee acc. High priority, but meeble cool down is shit, going to take FOREVER ;(

A.Omega /ra pants. Honestly, sidegrade to Mirador due to lack of STR and lower acc. But wanted to test rapid shot effect on it D;

Your relic and it's value

After chocobo blinker nerf and all that inevitable shit storm on official forum(official forum has been shit storm since day 1 btw), I can’t help but find it funny at how majority of player acting as if SE will kill this game with several nerf hammer. And as if SE hand out gil and gear to everyone, the game will keep running forever because everyone is happy.

Player base response:”Nooooo, I can never afford a relic/mythic anymore!” “Noooo, now the game is going back to lv 75 era when only rich ppl own a relic, majority of player can’t afford it!!”

I guess time to talk about the factor of relative value in FFXI.

If ppl can calm down,  and rethink, then look at things from bigger picture.

Does nerfing chocobo blinker makes everyone more broke? Most likely not for average players.

Atm there are ppl posting on forums, with SS of capped gil on multiple characters. Obviously those players have multiple relic/Mythic, owned 10+ account, leech cruor at work/sleep, then bot NPC all of them and convert cruor to gil when they work/sleep too.

They make millions and millions of gil everyday. And those gil went to economy, everyone else’s gil devalue.

The fact is, if you ever try to convert cruor to gil pre-nerf with just 1 character, you will find it’s less gil per hour than dyna/salvage/ADL. Thus I rarely make gil from cruor. Unless I have events, I usually play about 2hr a day and I don’t bot. If I go to dyna, I make more gil than warping back and forth turning those cruor to gil, so there’s no way I’d convert cruor to gil when I can make more gil in dyna.

And average player should be in same boat as me(honestly, I know more fish botter than NPC blinker botters), I don’t know a whole lot of player that actually can abuse cruor/gil enough to gain huge advantage of it. Most ppl probably just convert small amount of gil here and there for some extra cash. Compare with afk leechers/NPC blinker players, it’s pretty small lost. And once all item price go down,  those who doesn’t abuse cruor NPC with multiple account and bot will get biggest benefit.

If you don’t own multiple account, don’t NPC blinkers with bot, then other ppl who is currently doing it, will devalue your gil and make you more broke. Thus chocobo blinker NEED a nerf. Chocobo blinker, does nothing except encourage botting and paying 120$ a month for all characters(although you can probably make real money back by selling cruor gil, but that’s another discussion)

Now on to relic.

Some ppl argue that the game is “better” if everyone is rich, can afford a relic, and happy ever after.

However, they did not consider the value for the relic(or mythic/lv 99 empy, expensive weapons in general) compare with the amount of player owns it.

In this game, there will always be a gap between super rich higher tier player, average middle-class, casual player with less money, and new player without 1 lv 99 job or just ding lv 99 yesterday. And there will be content with different difficulty designed for different ppl. Thus serious hardcore player do hardcore content, casual player do casual content etc.

Back at lv 75, only super rich higher tier player have a relic. Some average middle-class players can maybe afford one if they grind for many years.

Back at lv 75, maybe 1% of player base has a relic. Majority of endgame player doesn’t.

Now that more ppl have relic. Super rich player have multiple relic, average player maybe have 1 or 2. Casual probably will work on one slowly, some are almost done with 1 or 2.

Now that majority of endgame player taking endgame seriously, probably will have at least 1 relic for their main job. The playerbase with a relic, is undeniably higher than it used to be.

Thus everyone’s relic just devalued because more player has one.

Now that next thing, and typical SE forum reaction will be “ZOMG you’re just elitist! Why can’t every casual player own a relic! You just want to be an unique snowflake!”

However, they did not factor the game content balance and it’s relative difficulty, which is tied to the population of players with relic.

I’m going to be blunt and say this, atm, if some jobs doesn’t have certain relic/lv 99 empy/Mythic, that job is not going to perform properly in harder endgame  such as legion hall of Mul.

Those jobs are: WAR needs Rag for MS zerg, Rag MS zerg is just way too OP nowaday.  DRK needs Rag, this weapon is just too good. BRD needs lv 99 empy harp(and it’s more of an impact once embrava nerf came, due to needing extra song slot for march) DRG needs Rynohige, DRG without Rynohige has little value as a DD. RNG needs relic gun/bow, the main strength of RNG over another melee DD is low enmity ranged WS and no reason to use it over another melee(although in the case of legion hall of Mul, buffed last stand may work).

And too an lesser extent, PLD benefits greatly from Aegis too. Oh, should I start talking about weaker DD such as SAM MNK, pretty much need lv 99 empy to catch up to average DRK for endgame today?

However, back at lv 75, no job “require” relic/Mythic to beat endgame content. When I did Einherjar with Sinister, only Saber has relic. When I did with Escaflowne, the only relic owner(who is a PLD) doesn’t play PLD in T1~T3 chambers. When I did with many endgame event with different LS, usually entire ally has 0~1 relic.

Now if I enter legion hall of Mul, BRD has relic, DD x5 has relic or empy 99, PLD has relic. The amount of relic in ally is slightly higher than 75 era.

And what happen is that SE already know about it, and will balance the content difficulty based on the percentage of relic owner. So if 1% of player base has relic, the the mob won’t be as hard. If 5% of player has relic, then the content will be more difficult because players are stronger. If 10% of player has relic, then the content will be even more difficult, and relic or gtfo if you want to do this content. SE already know players will enter Mul with an ally of relic owners, like how they know that players will utilize PD/embrava zerg strategy. They already know players will bring Rag WAR MS zerg, or Ryunohige DRG spamming Angon, or empy 99 BRD singing 4 songs, or PLD with Aegis, or relic RNG that generates little enmity to all current endgame events. Now Mul is at a difficulty that if you didn’t enter with an ally of multiple relic/empy 99 owners(and doesn’t gimp in skill/other slot of gears), you will have a very hard time. And Voidwatch, is at a difficulty that if your DD isn’t empy DD or merit WS DD, you will also have a very hard time. All Average Joe has a relic, just makes relic less valuable,  doesn't make average Joe rich nor pimp. 

SE hand out items to casual or middle-class players, does not make those player “pimp”, does not make them more powerful, and does not suddenly make content more accessible to everyone. Middle-class player will stay as middle-class player, 75 era or not. Casual will stay as casual, lv 75 or not. Content designed to only beatable by a group of serious dedicated endgame player, will never be friendly to casual player even if relic become obtainable. I still kick relic casuals that doesn’t parse high and no proper PDT-/MDT- set in event, or tell them to job change to mage jobs.

Hand out relic/empy 99 to players, will just make relic/empy 99 a requirement for harder endgame content, nothing more and nothing less.

Thus I found it extremely funny that players on SE forum often bitch about couldn’t get items because they’re casual. Unless all game content are designed for casuals and force everyone to be equal (which isn’t good for a MMORPG too), casuals will never really gain a benefit from getting items hand out to everyone. GL trying to clear legion hall of Mul wave 3+ with a group of none-relic/Nyzul F100 gear players.

Sure, getting relic for everyone makes everyone happy. But the connection tied to other players devalues it and you aren’t really becoming more powerful when comparing with game content and other players. That’s why I’d say chocobo blinker nerf shitstorm, on top of “omg I can’t finish a relic anymore!” comment is nothing but irrational reactions.

P.S(and douche mode on): Oh and btw, my empy  99 gun value just went up a little due to less profit from spamming VW and less ppl doing it. Should I be happy? :D It devalued pretty bad in past 3 months when surplus of 85k hMP sitting in bazzar cuz everyone spamming T3 VW   D;

But hey, empy 99 gun already have no value when I mainly pull in legion ;(

When all those hMP should have go to a harp or ukon 99 ;(

;(

My gun ;(

Nerf storm

For the past 2 days, SE been handing out nerf hammer in FFXI, 1st there is chocobo blinker nerf, then planned PD/embrava nerf.

To sum up some observation regarding chocobo blinker nerf:

Chocobo blinker botters and ppl afk leech cruor will get biggest hit.

Empy lv 99 value may go up due to less ppl interesting in doing VW.

Honestly though, I(or any player doesn't afk bot/leech NPC cruor) should* get benefit from chocobo blinker nerf. Personally I never find it possible to take advantage to make gil due to my way of playing this game. I only have 1 account, with limited inventory space, on top of I don't bot, it's less gil/hr than dyna/salvage/ADL for me, thus I rarely convert cruor when I can spend my playtime to solo salvage/dyna for more gil/hr. Chocobo blinker affects those who leech cruor at work/sleep with 12 accounts the most, and NPC them while sleep/work for capped gil. Now that majority of item should get cheaper for everyone, I see ppl with 1 account, or newer player should get biggest benefit.

So fish bot nerf when??? ;D


As for embrava nerf, it's pretty major hit for legion, on top of SMN now actually require capped skill to be useful. Making legion ally will just be harder, to a point that -10% HP can never compensate.

Last week in 1.0

One more week until we going to say goodbye to FF14 1.0.

Due to how hard to even put together a pt to do anything atm, I decided to try to grab all the tele point in 14.

I dragged Ager to travel with me. Personally I found it funny that he still called me "Afa" in 14, despite I used a different name. And if I call him his 14 name, he lold at me.

It's certainly an unique experience, to play with FF11 friend, and still calling each other names in 11.

We head to many dangerous areas while sight seeing on the way, riding our choco. Tunnel full of lv70+ bombs, giant bridge and epic waterfall, empty fort invested with monsters. And mobs that one shot me with 3.5k dmg on the way and needed his raise D;

We travel together,watch the scenery, chat about random subject(since I haven't seen him in 11 for ages), laughed at his female char ;D

Those are something I can no longer experience in 11, when I traveled to damn every places in 11, and able to kill every mob on the way with no danger.

And yet if it isn't because of 11, I will never do such thing such as adventuring with an old friend.

FF14 is an extension of 11, in a way.

Once upon a time I had such experience, when I first did rank 5 story BCs, travel to cold northland, which was a lonnng walk. Once upon a time I gained sea access after months of CoP static(and Ager was in it too) before CoP cap removed, and "OOOO" when we reached sea. But now it's no longer the same. Now it's log on, solo salvage or dyna, make ally for VW or legion.

I started 14 to start a new MMO, with new identity and play with new ppl, and it ended up become part of 11 experience, pretty ironic huh?

Either way. One more week until 1.0 shuts down, hope I can clear last GC quest I need by then D;

SSR

Recently I've been playing with the idea of BLU solo SSR farm alex. BLU has the ability to solo SSR alex farm, the zone with highest alex gain rate. If you solo, it has avg 60ish alex a run without pouch drop from boss, and obviously higher if boss dropped pouch. That's almost nearly as good gil/hr as dyna. And below are some of the tips and tricks I found.

The hardest part of SSR solo is to deal enough dmg in limited time, since you need to kill a lot of shit to  reach boss.

The ideal SJ IMO, is /RDM, due to convert every 10 min. Theoretically other SJ such as /THF /DNC works too, just need to bring a bit more hi-elixir vile elixir for MP recover, but I'm a cheap ass ._. You also need to bring echo drops if you're not subbing DNC.

Personally I'm able to clear 4x 100% pouch NM completely cheap(no echo/elixir used and /DNC) However, boss needs extra 7~10 min which needs more items, at least for me. Still debating whether spending extra gil on med/echo is worth it or not since boss has such low pouch drop rate.......

You need to kill A LOT of mobs to reach 4x 100% pouch NM and boss, thus killing speed is important.    The best way to achieve this is to burn MP like hell, and recover MP with temp item and med, with no hesitation to use the item.

The most useful temps are MP/HP recover temps, hi/mega elixir, wing, fanatic. So it's a bit luck dependent too, the more of those items you get, the faster you kill. Don't hesitate to use them if you see 2nd dropped. Just use and get a new one.

AoE spells such as Whirl of Rage, B.typhoon, Empty thrash, Charged whisker, Gate of Hades(note that if you GoH, you better make sure you don't need to AoE sleep them afterward) are useful to kill multiple mobs at once, since there are really A LOT of mobs need to be killed. If there's Fanatic up, use it and that allow you to play Dynasty Warrior with AoE burn without chance of getting swarmed and die for a while. You should try to AoE burn mobs as much as possible, it's key to kill fast enough to clear SSR.

Anything after 2nd floor hits quite hard and quite dangerous if you AoE burn, so fanatic helps killing speed.


Other tips and tricks are just usual dyna solo stuff, such as regen spell for efficient cure, Sanguine blade(although sanguine is a lot weaker outside of dyna....) for HP recover if CA not up and so on.



1st Floor: Head to Hammerblow pop area while killing everything on the way to unlock stat, but no need to unlock all things since the mobs that pops the NM and 2nd floor will drop a lot of extra cells too.

You have to kill 6 mobs at once to pop Hammerblow, those 6 mobs doesn't hit too hard and not all that dangerous, so Whirl of Rage, Gate of hades, Empty thrash until they die.

Hammberblow isn't anything special, SC and etc until it dies. After Hammberblow, sneak/invis and go up.


2nd Floor: Head to Powderkeg spawn room and kill everything. It's quite dangerous to link/aggro more than 3 at once, so avoid to aggro more than 3. But less than 3 is manageable with AoE. Convert every 10 min when recast is up, use elixir if you find them in chest/brought it.

Powderkeg is nothing special too, although a bit stronger than 1st floor boss. Kill it with SC etc.

3rd Floor: Set both sheep song and dream flower on 3+ floor just in case.

Head to Gyroscopic room and kill all gears with piercing spells and SC. Gears hits harder than previous fodder, so be careful if you want to AoE burn a lot of them at once. Although they're usually safe with 2x sleep spells.

Again, AoE sleeps x2, shadows from Occu and fanatic if you have extra(try to save 1 for 4th floor though) are best friend for AoE burn.

Gyroscopic isn't much different from previous NM. SC and spell spam until it dies. But this NM hits a lot harder than previous NM, especially TP move, without some defensive spells up it can become MP sponge. Don't let HP drop below 1k and pop shadows. Can also pop harden shell to lower the dmg taken.

You need to defeat the correct rampart to open the door, the correct one is the one that "try to move but can't move". Another way is to run around and aggro/link all and run away. Sleep them all, kill the one that can't move, log out to lose aggro or just go to next floor before they wake up.

4th floor: This is where you have to deal with A LOT of gears at once since they're easily linked, especially if gear train come when you pulled multiple gears/rampart(that happened to me several times ;D). If fanatic is up(you should save one if you see one), pop them and play dynasty warrior with all the AoE spell you got. Drink Elixir when MP gone, and spam MORE AoE spell. The more target you can hit at once, the faster you can clear everything. Sleep/AoE flash when you feel it's about to wear. Or you can sleep right after a Whirl of Rage. Harden shell/Occu shadows are nice to keep you alive too. It's quite dangerous to deal with this many gears via AoE burn solo, but if you managed to do it, you will feel a sense of satisfaction due to how OP BLU is in salvage(BLU is truly OP in salvage...for real) XD....it's not something every job can do XD

Boss: This boss charms every 25%, so you must try to keep some form of DoT up on it to avoid it regen back it's health if you still want to kill it quickly.

It seems that 1 SC+ 1~2 big spell can deal 25% of dmg, so watch it's HP, when it's about to hit 75% 50% 25%, use Disseverment, BioII(from /RDM), cold wave and so on on it, make sure you cure HP to full or have SS up too. Note that I found poison can't overwrite themselves, so it may be a good idea to separate the DoTs. Would be kinda lame if all DoT were gone during charm.

And special thanks to Sekundes for the boss tips XD

Jobs and job change. FFXI and FFXIV

It's been 2 years since I started FFXIV, time flies.

When I started, it's a game with a battle system that you spam confirm button to attack, and you gain skill up during the fight. You got physical level and class rank instead of just job level, in the course of 2 years, it changed a lot, in many ways.

If I'm going to summarize what I feel about FFXIV after those 2 years, IMO, FFXIV is everything FFXI should have done, and done right..... well, besides shitty AH(not really called AH in 14 though) system.

One thing I feel FFXIV did really well, it's the job system.

One thing I noticed in FFXI, every once a while, on BG, and several other forums, and LS chat, is whenever one person says "X job is loljob" "Y job is useless", there are always ppl stand up and counter with "That's because you never play with ppl good at X job". Then the vicious circle continues and loop endlessly.

The fact is, FFXI has more jobs than majority of other MMO on the market(and they're adding more too), and every content/event bound to have an optimal setup.

When you have an optimal setup and 20 jobs on job list, some jobs bound to sit out of optimal setup, and a few jobs bound to sit out of optimal setup for every event and become "the useless job".

Then next thing is, the job defender will pop and tell you "That's because you don't know how to adapt" "You can clear with other setup/strat too"

So I'm going to clarify the definition of "Optimal setup".

Optimal setup means, the most efficient way to do the content, with more room for error, and easiest to execute.

For example, if one NM has 3 ways to kill it, 1 way is to have an army of PUPs kite nuking spending 30 min, 2nd way is to have 1 PLD tanking it while an army of relic RNG shooting it down spending 15 min, 3rd way is to have properly hasted WARs 2hr zerg it down in 3 min with SMN PD and SCH embrava, then the "Optimal setup/strat" is WAR SMN SCH 2hr zerg, NOT PLD turtle+RNG shoot it down, nor PUP army nuke.

Because killing the NM in 3 min is fastest, thus it's optimal. No matter what event you do, there are always currently discovered most optimal setup with highest chance to succeed and fastest to get it done. And when you get the option to job change to form an optimal setup to do it in easier/faster way, there are little room for jobs that doesn't fit into less optimal setup/strat.

That's just same thing as debate on doing Mul with an army of SMN, or just rely on stun and PDT-.
After doing quite a bit of Mul, I do believe that SMN PD is the safest, easiest way to do it, with less chance to wipe and deathga. Even if no SMN is doable, I still preferred to have SMN.

So why there are always "job defenders" that's against "Optimal setup" and telling everyone else that another setup works too, even though in reality it won't work as well?

One possibility is probably just simple love of the job, that nobody want their beloved job to be left out.

But maybe there's more to that. When you can job change, does it matter?

Funny thing is, I rarely see such problem exist in FFXIV.

In FFXIV, the design mentality is, you NEED several jobs in this game, that's the design mentality in FFXIV. When you're doing A, you use A setup in this game, when you do B, you use B setup. You will need to job change in event/raid depending on which part you're in, and must have several jobs available for raid/event. A lot of things in FFXIV clearly designed for ppl to bring multiple jobs and job change in the middle of raid.

And nobody is really against such mentality. Majority of players have several or all jobs available, made macro for job change so they can job change fast. And anyone without several jobs leveled, they're often working on it without another word.

But it isn't the same in FFXI. In FFXI, if you ask anyone to lv A job for A event, and B job for B event, quite a lot of player will Q.Q T.T all day long. That includes Afania, of course, a player who played for 3 years and still only have 2 jobs and always refuse to lv a new one.

I'm guessing that's probably because lving/gearing a new job in FFXI is 1000x times more of a hassel than 14, and a lot of design in FFXI seems to be against players lving multiple jobs, despite optimal setup still exists in 11. At least that's my personal reason not to bother with 3rd jobs. The reward/effort ratio isn't worth it.

In order to get a job in FFXI usable, it needs to go through the process of having to skill up, drop millions and millions on relic, sacrifice precious merit point WS, make 10 gear sets for your jobs, and have fun spending 30 min doing job change ;)

Many FFXIV players have all jobs lv 50, and pretty equal performance(many players on BG been posting multiple relic already) But I rarely see ppl with all jobs in 11 have equal performance, most of them either leave a few jobs not used, or spend 30 min to job change every time they use a rarely used job and cried and whined every time they job change.

The fact that FFXI is slightly slower paced than FFXIV, and the fact that there's gear swap, plus the fact that you're limited to 3 merit WS and 1 mission reward augment, pretty much all against the idea of having multiple job leveled and use optimal setup for each situation, that's almost like anti-job change in FFXI.

When 11 been released for this long time, I can't help but feel FFXI needs a complete overhaul, a Realm Reborn like FFXIV(despite I don't like overhaul at all, felt effort to get gear is wasted when everything changed)

Gear swap is one of the most shit system ever exist in 11, it makes the game 100 times less enjoyable to carry this many gears. As the game item count gets bigger and bigger, and more JA/enhance JA pieces are added every update, plus extremely situational, but not completely useless pieces added, you get the result of having to spend 30 min to job change every time. Or else your job gonna gimp. Not to mention macro system is not gear swapping friendly at all either.

I mean, as a DD, how can you not to carry your PDT/MDT- set, embrava up/embrava down TP set, high acc/low acc TP set, X JA up/down TP/WS set, and JA macro for every JA, and possibility multiple weapons for proc????

Not to mention the time/effort of getting one job ready to use starting from lv 0. There's quest to unlock it, then lv it to lv 99, skill up necessary weapon/magic, some of the jobs even require multiple skills to be usable, such as WAR. And some skill up is total shit or expensive to do, such as COR on Marksmanship. If you're a mage, you need to buy/quest quite a large amount of spells too. Then you need to grind necessary basic gears, some cost quite a lot, such as BB for MNK.

The process of getting 1 job ready to use for event in 14, removed a lot of hassle in the process though.

And I feel this is how a FF MMORPG should have been.

FFXIV streamlined alot of unnecessary shit in FFXI, so players can jump right into the game and enjoy the core element of FF game in an MMORPG, that is job change, and finding out a most optimal strat with most optimal setup to beat the content, instead of complained about having to job change because it takes 30 min, or having to use auto script and hide somewhere to skill up your enhancing/summoning magic after your job ding lv 99.

Although there's also gear grind, do quest for additional abilities like 11, but in general, it's much faster to do it due to faster pace of the game. You also need slightly less gears to perform properly due to 11 just have way too many "situational" gears that you probably have to carry regardless.

I feel FFXI is a 100 year old machine, that is old, clumsy, and a lot of unnecessary shit that should have been deleted and rewrite. What's up with such long list of spells? With quite a large number of spells are unused most of the time. What's up with items like Sheltered Ring, that everyone idle with, DO YOU REALLY THINK IDLE IN SHELTERED RING IS SO PRO SO ELITE CUZ IT'S SO FUN TO CARRY 200 GEARS PER JOB D; D; D; And what's up with lol 2hr reset every Nyzul/legion run D;

In other words, FFXI shouldn't have this many jobs, this many gears, this many spells.....it got clumsy with those.

FFXIV streamlined everything, little JA/spells on the list, but most of them are fairly effective. BRD in 14 only has an acc song, a MP recover song, TP+, movement speed+, and a 15 min JA(much like 2hr in FFXI) to enhance potency. It's fairly simple and effective,  In FFXI BRD has over 50 songs before lv 50, a lot of songs has multiple tier, and you will never use lower tier at higher level. In FFXI you pop 2hr on BRD at the start in legion, and lock it entire run, so which just screams BS every way when one person in ally does nothing except sing songs for a few times entire event. And of course after event everyone go reset 2hr, because currently event is undoable without 2hr, and 2hr recast just way too long that you have to reset....see, another clumsy design. The fact that BRD has DD ability and WHM has more offensive ability is also, IMO, better design than how FF11 is, when every role is highly specialized(that's how we ended up having BRD in 11 or SCH in 11 do nothing except 2hr in legion/nyzul )

I guess that's just the way it goes, 14 dev team probably learned a lot from 11, and probably learned a lot from WoW too. IMO, this is what a good MMO should focus on, that anyone can dive in, relax, but still require quite a bit of skill and good planning on setup to beat the content, and quite content/event focused instead of old mentality of "create a MMO for you to live in the world" like old 14 or 11.

Certainly a long way for 14, starting from a MMORPG that everyone laughed at, and slowly walking on the right track to do everything correctly.

But really, I can't wait for 2.0.

1/3!

If anyone been paying attention to that "Project Death Penalty" thing that existed since more than 2 years ago, the number of alexandrite I turned in recently finally broke 5 digit, to over 10k alex.

I have to admit, after my arma 99 done, I've been slacking in terms of gil farm. I'm fairly happy with arma lv 99 performance. Although I tried to look for a situation where DP would out perform arma, sadly I doubt there's any atm. It's really hard for DP to outperform Arma in legion and VW, due to Arma's permanent  20 AGI and 10 acc without needing aftermath, ODD with just 100 TP, access to WF and so on.

Thus I'm starting to lose interest in Mythic project. Sometimes I can't help but wonder if I just farm gil for other items such as T.abj body HQ, it's a bigger improvement over Mythic.

Mythic to me, it's nothing but a status item, something to show off, brag about, but have very little actual value.

I question myself, should I continue, over and over again.

But in the end, I always choose to continue.

I don't know why.

Maybe I'm just obsessed with it for no reason, maybe I just feel empty whenever I log on to FFXI if I don't have such a goal.

Maybe I made a dumb choice that majority of players won't make.

But I guess that's the way I am, not the 1st day or 2nd day thing.

Plenty of players started Mythic, and give up mid-way.

There's no turning back for me now, 1/3!

Let's see if I can finish it in 2013 if I still play FFXI for another year ;)